Really got seduced by the Amiga, crazy graphics and sound for the time, nothing could display 320X240 with 4096 colour all at once, this could. 640X480 with 16 colours. A lot of games where available for it and eventually you could even emulate a PC and run mac apps with an expension card to only the mac bios. That was perfect.
What's your story ?
I grew up mostly using IBM-compatible PCs since that's what most people seemed to have. And my school had some Apple 2 computers that we played games on most. Later, my schools were using Macs, which I thought were
nice computers. My first computer at home was a hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 and a monochrome graphics card. I've pretty much stuck with
PCs, which I still use. I've had a couple Macs as secondary computers but I never really got to like Apple much.
thought were nice computers. My first computer at home was a
hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 and a monochrome graphics card.
I've pretty much stuck with PCs, which I still use. I've had a couple
Macs as secondary computers but I never really got to like Apple much.
Well nothing wrong with PC, we can all brag which platform was better than another and it would never end. Thing is that in the small town I grew up
go that way, was before pc anyway. Only thing I didn't liked when I had to was to program assembler on the 8086 model, coming from machine with Motorola cpu and Z80 the memory model was frustrating.
I wasn't bragging if that's what you are suggesting,
Also, I thought OS/2 was
technically better than Windows, but it was Windows that ended up selling the most and getting the most marketshare. That was perhaps also due to Microsoft's tactics in getting Windows pre-installed on PCs and their rules about what software a PC maker could install, etc..
I wasn't programming back then but I can see what you mean. I think that has changed since then though.
Ennev wrote to All <=-
What's your story ?
Ennev wrote to Nightfox <=-
Well nothing wrong with PC, we can all brag which platform was better
than another and it would never end. Thing is that in the small town I grew up there was one electronic store, a Radio Shack. So was kind of natural to go that way, was before pc anyway. Only thing I didn't liked when I had to was to program assembler on the 8086 model, coming from machine with Motorola cpu and Z80 the memory model was frustrating.
Nightfox wrote to Ennev <=-
I wasn't bragging if that's what you are suggesting, I was just stating what I had at the time. Back then I actually thought the Apple and
Amiga were ahead of the others for having a GUI, although I suppose I
felt like the PC did the job well enough. And it always seemed to me
that the technically best products were not the ones that sold the
most. It seemed that was up to marketing (at least as one factor).
Perhaps the Mac and Amiga were both more expensive than IBM PCs too.
Also, I thought OS/2 was technically better than Windows, but it was Windows that ended up selling the most and getting the most
marketshare. That was perhaps also due to Microsoft's tactics in
getting Windows pre-installed on PCs and their rules about what
software a PC maker could install, etc..
go that way, was before pc anyway. Only thing I didn't liked when I had to was to program assembler on the 8086 model, coming from machine with Motorola cpu and Z80 the memory model was frustrating.
I wasn't programming back then but I can see what you mean. I think
that has changed since then though.
I was talking with people about our first computers and stuff and it's interesting to see that we don't always have the same path.
What's your story ?
What's your story ?
Re: Introduction to computers
By: Ennev to All on Tue Oct 10 2017 11:41 am
Windows
95 seemed very different, when I first saw it, but I got used to it. Actually, I think that version of Windows had one of the more simple UIs.
the Commodore 64 was one I didn't take to,
the exception to the rule.
At the time, Microsoft's sales tactics were a big factor. The death knell for OS/2 for me was the lack of Win32 support. I didn't have the money or space for another PC, otherwise I would have left a dedicated OS/2 one running.
Windows 95 was a game changer, I remember how much it was expected. Here in Montreal when it got released people where waiting in line like if it was an iPhone release to have a chance to get the first copy of it.
Ennev wrote to Vk3jed <=-
I must that here I was a snob too. Was looking down on the C64 the day
I saw a basic listing for it in a magazine and saw that it was
essentially just a sequence of peek and poke. Hear that in assembly it
was fun to program for the 6502 been a great cpu. But was still doing basic then with a coco where doing graphic in basic was convenient.
But the C64 got a lot of people into personal computing, have to give
it that.
Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-
I remember an add-on for Windows 3.1 called Win32S which I think added
some 32-bit support to Windows 3.1. I don't remember if Win32S worked with OS/2's Windows subsystem though.. And I imagine Win32S still
wasn't enough to run 32-bit programs that most people wanted to run though. Certainly not Windows 95 apps..
Dumas Walker wrote to ENNEV <=-
Got exposed to a Tandy on a school trip. Thought it was neat I could
make it do things. Got a TI-99/4A a short while later. Was addicted
to it for a while... was not great at programming myself, but did learn
a few things by copying the code out of the 99'er magazines and (sometimes) making alterations or bug fixes myself.
Stopped computing for a while, then got an 8088-XT. To be honest, I am not sure I would have been real interested in it until I discovered BBSing. :)
Now I am in IT, and have been for over 20 years. That part may have
been a mistake. :)
Nightfox wrote to Ennev <=-
Windows 95 was a game changer, I remember how much it was expected. Here in Montreal when it got released people where waiting in line like if it was an iPhone release to have a chance to get the first copy of it.
I think it was like that everywhere. I heard about people lining up
here for a copy of Windows 95. That was the only time I can remember people lining up outside stores like that for a Microsoft product. At
the time, I think Apple was almost dead.. Once Steve Jobs was brought back to Apple, they started making products that people would line up
for outside stores. (For the record, I've never gone out to stand in
line like that for any computer product, no matter how excited I was
for it.)
the Commodore 64 was one I didn't take to,
the exception to the rule.
I must that here I was a snob too. Was looking down on the C64 the day I saw a basic listing for it in a magazine and saw that it was essentially just a sequence of peek and poke. Hear that in assembly it was fun to program for the 6502 been a great cpu. But was still doing basic then with a coco where doing graphic in basic was convenient.
But the C64 got a lot of people into personal computing, have to give it that.
I remember an add-on for Windows 3.1 called Win32S which I think added some 32-bit support to Windows 3.1. I don't remember if Win32S worked with OS/2's Windows subsystem though.. And I imagine Win32S still wasn't enough to run 32-bit programs that most people wanted to run though. Certainly not Windows 95 apps..
I think it was like that everywhere. I heard about people lining up here for a copy of Windows 95. That was the only time I can remember people lining up outside stores like that for a Microsoft product. At the time, I think Apple was almost dead.. Once Steve Jobs was brought back to Apple, they started making products that people would line up for outside stores. (For the record, I've never gone out to stand in line like that for any computer product, no matter how excited I was for it.)
Nightfox
Windows 95 was a game changer, I remember how much it was expected. Here in Montreal when it got released people where waiting in line like if it was an iPhone release to have a chance to get the first copy of it.
It really was a better interface. As much as I don't mind Program Manager, it seems more efficient to have icons on the desktop like Mac OS, Amiga Workbench, or GEM. You could still access your other apps via the Start Menu. This new interface was aparently so good that they still can't get away with getting rid of it about 20 years later.
What's your story ?
Windows 95 was a game changer, I remember how much it was expected.
Here in Montreal when it got released people where waiting in line
like if it was an iPhone release to have a chance to get the first
copy of it.
I remember an add-on for Windows 3.1 called Win32S which I think added some 32-bit support to Windows 3.1. I don't remember if Win32S worked with OS/2's Windows subsystem though.. And I imagine Win32S still wasn't enough to run 32-bit programs that most people wanted to run though. Certainly not Windows 95 apps..
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface.
What's your story ?
10 megabytes of disk space wasn't cutting it any more, so I picked up a RLL controller and reformatted the drive for 16 megabytes. I was delirious with the newfound space for 3 months, then bought a 30 megabyte drive.
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface
Nelgin wrote to Nightfox <=-
@VIA: VERT/EOTLBBS
@TZ: c168
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on
Wed Oct 11 2017 09:36 am
I remember an add-on for Windows 3.1 called Win32S which I think added some 32-bit support to Windows 3.1. I don't remember if Win32S worked with OS/2's Windows subsystem though.. And I imagine Win32S still wasn't enough to run 32-bit programs that most people wanted to run though. Certainly not Windows 95 apps..
I remember that so well that I can still remember the filename.
PW1118.EXE the Win32S installer. First thing I downloaded onto a
computer when I had Win 3.1 installed, then Trumpet Winsock and
probably Mosaic or Cello web browser.
---
þ Synchronet þ End Of The Line BBS
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
I heard RLL was just an encoding scheme which worked on MFM drives, so
RLL didn't actually require a different controller, just a drive
reliable enough to handle RLL encoding.
Nightfox wrote to Roadhog <=-
Yes, Windows 95 still had a win.com that could be run from a DOS prompt
to start up Windows. And Windows 95 could be configured to just boot
up to a DOS prompt without starting Windows, from what I remember..
Pparker wrote to Roadhog <=-
Yeah, but, at least for MS-DOS and Windows, it was the
first time the GUI was actually like the modern GUI we use
today. And since I think by that point Windowa had already
become, or was about to be, the dominant platform, it was a
big deal.
today. And since I think by that point Windowa had already
become, or was about to be, the dominant platform, it was a
big deal.
Windows 95's user interface was a big improvement over Windows 3.x. I took to it pretty easily.
Also, I thought OS/2 was
technically better than Windows, but it was Windows that ended up selling the most and getting the most marketshare. That was perhaps also due to Microsoft's tactics in getting Windows pre-installed on PCs and their rul about what software a PC maker could install, etc..
Yes, a bit sad, because OS/2 was really a better os. At the end it's not allways the best technology that win.
I wasn't programming back then but I can see what you mean. I think that has changed since then though.
Oh yes, dramatically. with 32 and 64 address space in use now. Under dos and win 95 intel cpu behaved more like a 16 bit machine in memory handling.
Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-
Windows 95's user interface was a big improvement over Windows 3.x. I took to it pretty easily.
Yeah, I liked Windows 95's interface.
I never really used Windows prior to 3.0, and I think it's funny to
look at some of the screenshots of Windows 1.x and 2.x. They had an "MS-DOS Executive", which I think sounds funny for some reason..
Running a GUI environment and then having a "MS-DOS Executive"? And
early versions of Windows didn't allow overlapping windows.. I heard Apple and Microsoft were arguing over a patent on that or something
(and of course, Apple lost that argument).
Nightfox wrote to Pparker <=-
From what I remember, Windows was already a fairly big thing by Windows 3.1 (or even 3.0). Other GUIs existed at the time (OS/2, GeoWorks,
etc.) but had a hard time gaining marketshare compared to Windows.
Yes, the 8086 memory model was a pain. I did dabble in 8086 assembler at uni, got the hang of it mostly. :) Programming assembler on other processors, like the 6809 or Z80 (what little I did of Z80) was a breeze, by comparison. :)
What makes an os better ? how its made under the hood or the presentation or the UI in the OS. I don't know anything about OS/2 but I'd like to know what made it better.
Re: Win 95
By: Roadhog to Mr. Cool on Wed Oct 11 2017 10:51 pm
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface.
Yes, Windows 95 still had a win.com that could be run from a DOS prompt to start up Windows. And Windows 95 could be configured to just boot up to a D prompt without starting Windows, from what I remember..
Nightfox
on that). People have (almost jokingly) said OS/2 was the best platform to run
DOS software because it was able to multi-task DOS very well. Many sysops used
OS/2 to run multi-node BBSes. Also, not really for OS/2 itself, but there was >a serial port driver for OS/2 called SIO which I remember being fairly popular.
I seem to remember SIO including a built-in FOSSIL driver and being able to >allow DOS BBS software and doors to be accessible on the internet via telnet.
It really was a better interface. As much as I don't mind Program Manager, it seems more efficient to have icons on the desktop like Mac OS, Amiga Workbench, or GEM. You could still access your other apps via the Start Menu. This new interface was aparently so good that they still can't get away with getting rid of it about 20 years later.
poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-
I did my assembly on a VAX. Nice instruction set, easy memory handling.
Nightfox wrote to Bigbangnet <=-
OS/2 had very good multi-tasking. It probably had pre-emptive
multi-tasking while Windows 3.1 had cooperative multi-tasking (though
you shouldn't quote me on that). People have (almost jokingly) said
OS/2 was the best platform to run DOS software because it was able to multi-task DOS very well. Many sysops used OS/2 to run multi-node
BBSes. Also, not really for OS/2 itself, but there was a serial port
driver for OS/2 called SIO which I remember being fairly popular. I
seem to remember SIO including a built-in FOSSIL driver and being able
to allow DOS BBS software and doors to be accessible on the internet
via telnet.
My dad gotten an Atari ST to run a packet radio BBS on it, and wasn't successful because of the software he had at the time. He found an IBM-compatible computer and working software for it, and I got the Atari ST afterward. I only played games on it, and did a little bit of programming
on it. It was that Atari ST computer that got me into BBSes. As I've mentioned before, I would go onto the 486 and connect to the local computer shop's BBS and just download games for the Atari ST.
Nightfox wrote to Ennev <=-The Amiga was particularly impressive, with a full colour GUI and
impressive audio capabilities. The early Mac was an impressive machine in its day, though I found the Classic MacOS too dumbed down for my liking.
I'd gotten a 1050 drive by then--Atari's "enhanced density" 5 1/4"
drive, but still single-sided disks that you'd sometimes have to turn over. So that was a whole new level of experiences.
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface.
It's a common misconception that Windows 9x was just running on top of DOS as Windows 3.1 did. When I did a little reading I found out that once DOS and it's drivers loaded, Windows would start and take a snapshot of the current DOS state, then proceed to shutdown DOS. If a DOS function was needed, it was able to call up that snapshot to use it's DOS sub-system.
Or simply run a BBS on a non dedicated machine. OS/2 allowed one to do other things, without compromising overall performance and with great stability.
STMy dad gotten an Atari ST to run a packet radio BBS on it, and wasn't successful because of the software he had at the time. He found an IBM-compatible computer and working software for it, and I got the Atari
erafterward. I only played games on it, and did a little bit of programming on it. It was that Atari ST computer that got me into BBSes. As I've mentioned before, I would go onto the 486 and connect to the local comput
inshop's BBS and just download games for the Atari ST.
Was the ST format compatible with a PC? 31/2 drive on amiga would use a different encoding that would give 880K instead of 720, you had to find a converter software (not included) to be able to read ibm disks. Was a paint
the ....
It's nice to be able to do that. I tend to prefer running my BBS on a dedicated machine though. I used to run my BBS in a virtual machine on my main PC, but when I needed to reboot my main PC for any reason, that meant taking down my BBS for a few minutes while my PC rebooted.
i highly suggest running your bbs on a rented server if you can afford it.
I'd gotten a 1050 drive by then--Atari's "enhanced density" 5 1/4"
drive, but still single-sided disks that you'd sometimes have to turn ove So that was a whole new level of experiences.
Was kind of the same on TRS-80, disk where single sided, but you could but a "notcher" so you could filp the disk around and use both side :-D
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: MRO to Nightfox on Mon Oct 16 2017 03:03 pm
i highly suggest running your bbs on a rented server if you can afford it.
Why would I want to do that when I can run my BBS from home? At home, I
and the machine is right
there for me to access if I want to upgrade it, and I'd think it would be at least slightly easier to do backups with the machine right there for me to access. If power reliability is an issue, I have a UPS power backup on my
Was kind of the same on TRS-80, disk where single sided, but you could but a "notcher" so you could filp the disk around and use both side :-D
i highly suggest running your bbs on a rented server if you can
afford it.
Why would I want to do that when I can run my BBS from home? At home,
because it's a lot better than running it at home.
you dont get attacks, it's stable, doesnt take up space , doesnt take up power.
i dont need to upgrade hardware because the hardware is great already. backups are automated. i even get free space to store my backups.
i have 100% uptime.
My BBS machine at home is fairly stable, and it's not a huge PC so it doesn't take up a whole lot of space, and I think its power usage isn't that bad. Several years ago I bought a power meter and figured I was paying maybe up to $20 per year to run my BBS machine. I don't mind that.i highly suggest running your bbs on a rented server if you can
afford it.
i highly suggest running your bbs on a rented server if you can MR>> afford it.
Why would I want to do that when I can run my BBS from home? At home,
because it's a lot better than running it at home.
you dont get attacks, it's stable, doesnt take up space , doesnt take power.
My BBS machine at home is fairly stable, and it's not a huge PC so it doesn't take up a whole lot of space, and I think its power usage isn't that bad. Several years ago I bought a power meter and figured I was paying maybe up to $20 per year to run my BBS machine. I don't mind
that.
Anyhow, I run mine off a rented server and love it. Reliable, faster transfer speeds, static IP, no port blocking by the ISP, etc. That said, I would probably run it from home if I had a ups battery backup and my kids would leave the computer alone. Numerous times I've come home from work and the computer has been shut off, unplugged or tipped over. They crashed a virtualbox VM once by unplugging the computer while it was running.
MRO wrote to Nightfox <=-
i guess you'd have to do it to understand it.
i'm loving it.
Immortal wrote to Nightfox <=-
What kind of computer do you have that uses so little energy?
I can't find my kill a watt meter to actually measure how much the computer uses but guesstimating 100 watts 24 hours a day at my rate of .115 per kwh thats $9 a month.
Anyhow, I run mine off a rented server and love it. Reliable, faster transfer speeds, static IP, no port blocking by the ISP, etc. That
said, I would probably run it from home if I had a ups battery backup
and my kids would leave the computer alone. Numerous times I've come
home from work and the computer has been shut off, unplugged or tipped over. They crashed a virtualbox VM once by unplugging the computer
while it was running.
MRO wrote to Nightfox <=-
i guess you'd have to do it to understand it.
i'm loving it.
To me, it's more a horses for courses thing. I've had a VPS for many years, which runs a lot of services. But I choose to run BBSs on R-Pi boards at home.
That's actually cheaper for me to do.
Recently dug my O.G. 1986 64C out of mothballs and suddenly realized that, hey, I'm a grown up and I can damn well buy an Amiga if I want to, so I got an A500. So learning that a bit, though it's a bit of a curve compared to the 64.
What kind of computer do you have that uses so little energy?
he probably did the calculation wrong. with a display or two, and if its on all day long it can be about 25 bucks a month.
Why would I want to do that when I can run my BBS from home? At home, I
bad. Several years ago I bought a power meter and figured I was paying maybe up to $20 per year to run my BBS machine. I don't mind that.
Why would I want to do that when I can run my BBS from home? At home,
My own box I bring up and down all the time for upgrades, testing, kicking out the cable under my desk etc.
Incidentally I don't run sbbs as root but as its own user then use DNAT redirect the lower ports. So when someone telnets in on 23 or uses ssh
on 22 it actually redirects them to 2300 or 2200 respectively. I do this for all the ports including the UDP ones.
bad. Several years ago I bought a power meter and figured I was
paying maybe up to $20 per year to run my BBS machine. I don't mind
that.
Until your hard disk dies or your power supply dies or your cooling fan gives up and burns out your CPU...
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Nightfox to MRO on Tue Oct 17 2017 09:45 am
bad. Several years ago I bought a power meter and figured I was paying maybe up to $20 per year to run my BBS machine. I don't mind that.
Until your hard disk dies or your power supply dies or your cooling fan gives up and burns out your CPU...
fail and they'll have to replace it. When you're running the server at home, at least you don't have to wait for someone else to fix it; you can fix it yourself as soon as you can.
What kind of computer do you have that uses so little energy?
It's just a regular home-built PC tower. It's a fairly small tower though. If all it's doing is running a BBS, it shouldn't draw too much power.
I'd think cloud-based machines would also need to be taken down occasionally for upgrading etc.. Or sometimes there might be an unplanned power outage.
I found a way to enable the lower ports for non-root users in Linux. I don't remember offhand, but I know there's a way to do it. I don't remember
same thing with cloud-hosted servers - Eventually some of the hardware might fail and they'll have to replace it. When you're running the server at home, at least you don't have to wait for someone else to fix it; you can fix it yourself as soon as you can.
then your house burns down when you are gone and your dog dies!
Until your hard disk dies or your power supply dies or your cooling fan gives up and burns out your CPU...
then your house burns down when you are gone and your dog dies!
MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-
well i have this server that i use for a few things, and the diskspace
and the muscle and the memory is there, so i figured why not.
it's not cheaper. i'm not sure how much i'm saving. i pay half the bill and a donator pays the other because i manage hosting for him and other shit.
it's certainly easy and i'm happy with the results.
i did have to pay a friend to setup a linux vm on proxmox with one of
my ip addresses because i forgot how to do it. windows is super easy
with that. ---
MRO wrote to Immortal <=-
he probably did the calculation wrong. with a display or two, and if
its on all day long it can be about 25 bucks a month.
i dont believe he is using around 7cents a day of electricity on his
Nightfox wrote to MRO <=-
I don't leave the display on all the time. Actually it's off most of
the time, so it's just the tower running. I used a power meter to
measure its power use for a month and just multiplied that by 12 and
the cost power kwh. It's fairly simple math.. But I suppose I could
be remembering it wrong.
Nelgin wrote to Nightfox <=-
For me, several reasons. First I got a 256mb server with 25gb of disk space which will easily run sbbs for about $15 per year with high
uptime.
Incidentally I don't run sbbs as root but as its own user then use DNAT redirect the lower ports. So when someone telnets in on 23 or uses ssh
on 22 it actually redirects them to 2300 or 2200 respectively. I do
this for all the ports including the UDP ones.
Most hosted servers also have ipv6 available whereas my ISP doesn't and
a tunnel is going to be much slower. That said, my new provider isn't going to have ipv6 for about another 60-90 days :(
Nightfox wrote to Nelgin <=-
I'd think cloud-based machines would also need to be taken down occasionally for upgrading etc.. Or sometimes there might be an
unplanned power outage.
I found a way to enable the lower ports for non-root users in Linux. I don't remember offhand, but I know there's a way to do it. I don't remember the reasoning for not allowing the lower ports for non-root
users though.. I thought it was best practice to run as few things as possible non-root, so I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to have those ports available for non-root processes. If someone happens to find a
back door into your machine, running as a non-root process means they couldn't do very much harm (hopefully).
I don't leave the display on all the time. Actually it's off most of the time, so it's just the tower running. I used a power meter to measure its power use for a month and just multiplied that by 12 and the cost power kwh. It's fairly simple math.. But I suppose I could be remembering it wrong.
What was the power consumption in Watts? Multiply that by 720/1000 to get a rough kWh/month.
Nightfox wrote to Nelgin <=-
I'd think cloud-based machines would also need to be taken down occasionally for upgrading etc.. Or sometimes there might be an unplanned power outage.
It is trivial to migrate a running VPS from host to host these days, with no downtime (or so short you wouldn't notice).
ENNEV wrote to ALL <=-
Myself, I must say I've started early. Was borrowing a TRS-80 Model I, when the Trs-80 Color Computer got out it was a no brainer, got it with 16k or ram and extended basic. Was my main system for a long time and stayed faithful to the brand for a long time, getting a modem and
almost all the extension they had to it, went to 64k, floppy disk,
mouse, voice pak, serial port etc, you name it. Even got another coco
to run a bbs on it. Upgraded to a COCO3 and kept at it until Tandy
dropped it to go all ibm compatible.
What's your story ?
A few years later the bass player in my little bluegrass group was
going to college for computer programming and he had a TRS-80 Color
Computer (aka Trash 80 CoCo). It had the chicklet keys but still it
reminded me of the one my teacher had a few years prior, so for
Christmas my dad bought me a CoCo 2 with the realy keys! I subscribed
to Rainbow Magazine, I think it was, and learned BASIC.
One other obviousl downside is that you don't have a hardware speaker so you can't be paged. Well, you can but you'd never hear it. I'm sure some people have found a workaround. I was thinking a small client on the local computer that could receive a connection from the BBS to make a sound but that's beyond what I have time to figure out right now.
and the cost power kwh. It's fairly simple math.. But I suppose I
could be remembering it wrong.
What was the power consumption in Watts? Multiply that by 720/1000 to get a rough kWh/month.
then your house burns down when you are gone and your dog dies!
Then you move into a cloud home !
MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-
i do (watts/1000) x (hours per day it's turned on) x(31 days) =
kilowatt hrs per month
MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-
i just had something fuckup with my server vm when i rebooted.
i restored a backup that was on the local server and started her up and
i was back up and running.
couldnt be easier.
Nightfox wrote to Nelgin <=-
That could be done. I wrote a little socket-based application one time that did that, so when users would page me from the BBS, it would run
an app that would connect to my main PC and play a (configurable) sound file. The app I created was very simple though, and if I wasn't
running the app on my main PC, then the one on the BBS machine would
pause for several moments while it tried to connect (and failed). I eventually stopped using it.
I'm not sure how often users page me though.. Normally I'm away from
my BBS machine these days doing other things around the house and
probably wouldn't hear a page.
I'm not sure how often users page me though.. Normally I'm away from my BBS machine these days doing other things around the house and probably wouldn't hear a page.
What is needed is a pager/chat app. Would be good if it could be loaded on both a PC/Mac and a smartphone at the same time.
MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and
you get it on your phone.
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and you get it on your phone.
MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and you get it on your phone.
That's not going to do the job. Email is not the right medium for this, not real time enough, and if one is subscribed to many mailing lists, can't be sure which notification is the page. One of the IM services or using something like Pushover would be better for a page. Plenty of chat apps, something like XMPP could conceivably be used for page and chat.
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: MRO to Vk3jed on Fri Oct 20 2017 03:34 pm
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and you get it on your phone.
Why not? Paging seemed like a standard feature of BBS software back in the day, and sometimes a user might want to see if they can get you onto live chat. I used to enjoy chatting with my users sometimes. But I tend to just let them send an email if they want to ask something though.
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and
you get it on your phone.
Why not? Paging seemed like a standard feature of BBS software back in the day, and sometimes a user might want to see if they can get you onto live chat. I used to enjoy chatting with my users sometimes. But I tend to just let them send an email if they want to ask something though.
Why not? Paging seemed like a standard feature of BBS software back
in the day, and sometimes a user might want to see if they can get you
onto live chat. I used to enjoy chatting with my users sometimes. But
I tend to just let them send an email if they want to ask something
though.
those days are over with and we dont have those kinds of users anymore.
Recently dug my O.G. 1986 64C out of mothballs and suddenly realized that, hey, I'm a grown up and I can damn well buy an Amiga if I want to, so I got an A500. So learning that a bit, though it's a bit of a curve compared to the 64.
Commodore bought Amiga, so in a way it's a totally different beast. They where stalling in the development of theirs next generation so they swallowed Amiga to get them there. At one point i hear that Amiga could have been an Atari product.
if I'm not at home, i don't want to talk to you (not you personally). Anyone who really wants me knows where to find me. The BBS is a hobby and isn't going to creep into my off time.What is needed is a pager/chat app. Would be good if it could be loaded on both a PC/Mac and a smartphone at the same time.
those days are over with and we dont have those kinds of users anymore.
I'm trying to like the Amiga, but there's that whole abstraction layer between the machine and you. On the C64, I feel like I know how to manipulate every tiny nuance of the machine, whereas the Amiga has some
kind of software layer in between you and the machine. I dunno. I'll get a handle on it eventually.
So what kind of users do we get? Is it just sysops from other boards?
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: MRO to Vk3jed on Fri Oct 20 2017 03:34 pm
if I'm not at home, i don't want to talk to you (not you personally). Anyone who really wants me knows where to find me. The BBS is a hobby and isn't going to creep into my off time.What is needed is a pager/chat app. Would be good if it could be loaded on both a PC/Mac and a smartphone at the same time.
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: MRO to Nightfox on Fri Oct 20 2017 07:48 pm
those days are over with and we dont have those kinds of users anymore.
So what kind of users do we get? Is it just sysops from other boards?
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Fri Oct 20 2017 09:14 pm
I'm not sure how often users page me though.. Normally I'm away fro my BBS machine these days doing other things around the house and probably wouldn't hear a page.
What is needed is a pager/chat app. Would be good if it could be loaded both a PC/Mac and a smartphone at the same time.
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and you get on your phone.It was fun going on a BBS and chating with poeple but chating with the sysop was very cool. It gave you a new experience to the definition to the word appreciation for the work they've done. I had a more respect for them when they answered and talked to me. I liked it.
why would you want someone to page you? have them leave an email and you get on your phone.It was fun going on a BBS and chating with poeple but chating with the sysop was very cool. It gave you a new experience to the definition to the word appreciation for the work they've done. I had a more respect for them when they answered and talked to me. I liked it.
Re: Win 95
By: Mr. Cool to Nightfox on Sun Oct 15 2017 10:28 am
Shut down DOS? What does that mean? And I remember being able to exit from Windows 9x and get back to a DOS prompt (without Windows running), and you could even have it boot just to a DOS prompt without Windows.
Nightfox
those days are over with and we dont have those kinds of users
anymore.
So what kind of users do we get? Is it just sysops from other boards?
yeah, i dont get the reasoning. maybe it's because i've actually chatted with bbs users and it's not really a pleasant thing to do.
i'm reachable via irc or within 1 minute via email usually, so i dont need my computer beeping me to run to it and reply to someone.
now if i was getting PAID, then i want to know when a server is having issues in real time. email handles that too with the monitors you can use.
"... You have the right to remain silent! please use that right."
anymore.
So what kind of users do we get? Is it just sysops from other boards?
We get a little bit of a mix, we get one time callers, other Sysops and a
now if i was getting PAID, then i want to know when a server is having issues in real time. email handles that too with the monitors you can use.
What you don't get paid to run your BBS? JK running a BBS is just a great littl hobby that can take as much or little time as you want to put into it.
I'm trying to like the Amiga, but there's that whole abstraction layer between the machine and you. On the C64, I feel like I know how to manipulate every tiny nuance of the machine, whereas the Amiga has some kind of software layer in between you and the machine. I dunno. I'll get a handle on it eventually.
Maybe on the surface it looked like that, but to had done graphic and some demo game on Amiga in assembler it actually felt great, all the hardware was open for you to play with, the bios had a lot of great function so that even in assembler you could easily access the file system etc. But going directly to the hardware was fantastic. Bit yes some concept where different. For example the graphic array wasn't bitmap, but bitplanes. Sound was so easy to manipulate too. having learned assembler on 6809 going to a 68000 was so natural and the instruction set was clean, every instruction working in every addressing modes. but Would be like that too on an atari ST appart for all the co-processor that the amiga had. We even had a tiny cpu call copper that only had 4 instruction but was tied directly to the electon beam of the crt, so you could change the color palete on every scan line etc. even resolution. Nothing was preventing you to have like 1/3 of the screen on 640 pixel and 16 colour then having the next 2/3 in 320 pixel and 64 colour.
we also had a processor that could do vector graphic, so the cpu was free to do so much.
I'm trying to like the Amiga, but there's that whole abstraction layer between >the machine and you. On the C64, I feel like I know how to manipulate every >tiny nuance of the machine, whereas the Amiga has some kind of software layer >in between you and the machine. I dunno. I'll get a handle on it eventually.
Wow when I press "R" for random tagline I get this same stupid tag, not very random.
"... I may be schizophrenic, but at least I'll always have each other."
btw , knn4bn or whatever he calls himself put his bbs up again. guess those hackers stopped!
Wow when I press "R" for random tagline I get this same stupid tag,
not very random.
"... I may be schizophrenic, but at least I'll always have each
other."
Looks like that pick of taglines worked out beautifully! <g>
It was fun going on a BBS and chating with poeple but chating with the
sysop was very cool. It gave you a new experience to the definition to the word appreciation for the work they've done. I had a more respect for them when they answered and talked to me. I liked it.
I've noticed a lot of the demos and games from the A500 era won't cooperate with Workbench because of how "close to the metal" they are.
if I'm not at home, i don't want to talk to you (not you personally). Anyone who really wants me knows where to find me. The BBS is a hobby and isn't going to creep into my off time.
yeah, i dont get the reasoning. maybe it's because i've actually chatted with bbs users and it's not really a pleasant thing to do.
I think part of the definition of a hobby is something you do in your off ti isn't it?
I'm glad to see he got it all back up but I really wish he would'nt go around accussing people of hacking him.
If you think about it all our BBS's are being bombarded with hacking attempts on a daily basis, I just bought the Nighthawk AC1900 router that has built in DOS protection.
I wish Tim well but I'll never join his message base again.
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Nelgin to MRO on Sun Oct 22 2017 03:30 am
if I'm not at home, i don't want to talk to you (not you personally). Anyone who really wants me knows where to find me. The BBS is a hobby and isn't going to creep into my off time.
I think part of the definition of a hobby is something you do in your off time, isn't it?
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: MRO to Nelgin on Sun Oct 22 2017 10:54 am
yeah, i dont get the reasoning. maybe it's because i've actually chatted with bbs users and it's not really a pleasant thing to do.
I'm not sure what kind of BBS users you've chatted with, but almost all of my interactions with BBS users have been good and positive. If you don't enjoy interacting with your users, maybe that's a sign that you don't enjoy the hobby.
I'm not sure what kind of BBS users you've chatted with, but almost
all of my interactions with BBS users have been good and positive. If
you don't enjoy interacting with your users, maybe that's a sign that
you don't enjoy the hobby.
it's usually a boring conversation about how things used to be, or it's a foreign person with poor social skills. has nothing to do with 'the hobby' other than i get some boring people.
i think if everyone here was honest they could all agree that the amount and the quality of users has really dropped off.
i think a lot of your examples are hypotheticals and well wishing than actual things that happened.
I think part of the definition of a hobby is something you do in your off time, isn't it?
those days are over with and we dont have those kinds of users anymore.
So what kind of users do we get? Is it just sysops from other boards?
I'm trying to like the Amiga, but there's that whole abstraction layer between the machine and you. On the C64, I feel like I know how to manipulate every tiny nuance of the machine, whereas the Amiga has some kind of software layer in between you and the machine. I dunno. I'll get a handle on it eventually.
Maybe on the surface it looked like that, but to had done graphic and some demo game on Amiga in assembler it actually felt great, all the hardware was open for you to play with, the bios had a lot of great function so that even in assembler you could easily access the file system etc. But going directly to the hardware was fantastic. Bit yes some concept where different. For example the graphic array wasn't bitmap, but bitplanes. Sound was so easy to manipulate too. having learned assembler on 6809 going to a 68000 was so natural and the instruction set was clean, every instruction working in every addressing modes. but Would be like that too on an atari ST appart for all the co-processor that the amiga had. We even had a tiny cpu call copper that only had 4 instruction but was tied directly to the electon beam of the crt, so you could change the color palete on every scan line etc. even resolution. Nothing was preventing you to have like 1/3 of the screen on 640 pixel and 16 colour then having the next 2/3 in 320 pixel and 64 colour.
we also had a processor that could do vector graphic, so the cpu was free to do so much.
Oh yes, that's the thing. The vast majority of games where taking over, they only way out was reboot. They would totally take over the entire system, the os was multi-tasking but forget it when I game was running. From this aspect it was acting much more like a game machine.
That's why I'm so into the idea of the machine, and really want to learn
it. Started to look at some demos. There is some pretty graphically impressive stuff there. I know a little bit of 680x0 assembly, so it shouldn't be too hard to really dig in. Just have to get to it.
One of the things that I've had some trouble getting used to is the idea of booting software off floppies again. On the C64, it's a no-brainer. You're either using a physical disk or a .D64 as a virtual disk and running off that. But my brain has been so conditioned by Macs and Windows that I
*WANT* everything to run within Workbench, and that just isn't how it is. There's plenty of stuff that doesn't even need (or want) the OS to run.
to pop : MOVEM +(A7), D0 # take the content at the address pointed by A7 into register D0 and increment by one the address pointer A7
If you did Intel assembly you'll find it simpler. Some instruction have different name or some concept might be little different. Like no push or po instruction to use the stack. intead of a push you would do :
MOVEM D0, -(A7) # move the content of register D0 to the address pointed b A7 and decrement the address pointed by the pointer by 1
to pop : MOVEM +(A7), D0 # take the content at the address pointed by A7 into register D0 and increment by one the address pointer A7
So it end up doing the same thing as a push or a pop, but it also show the power of the instruction set.
Woooo... Personally, that is waaaay beyond my understanding. :) I never understood Assembly.
One of the things that I've had some trouble getting used to is the idea of booting software off floppies again. On the C64, it's a no-brainer. You're either using a physical disk or a .D64 as a virtual disk and running off that. But my brain has been so conditioned by Macs and Windows that I *WANT* everything to run within Workbench, and that just isn't how it is. There's plenty of stuff that doesn't even need (or want) the OS to run.
you need an operating system. if you dont have one you cant operate!
It was fun going on a BBS and chating with poeple but chating with the sysop was very cool. It gave you a new experience to the definition to th word appreciation for the work they've done. I had a more respect for the when they answered and talked to me. I liked it.
I guess I was an impopular sysop :-D because people where rarely paging me. And if I was starting a chat with someone logged on they would bang down rig away :-D
I guess i'm scary.
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Ennev to Derision on Tue Oct 24 2017 07:40:39
If you did Intel assembly you'll find it simpler. Some instruction have different name or some concept might be little different. Like no push or instruction to use the stack. intead of a push you would do :
MOVEM D0, -(A7) # move the content of register D0 to the address pointe A7 and decrement the address pointed by the pointer by 1
to pop : MOVEM +(A7), D0 # take the content at the address pointed by into register D0 and increment by one the address pointer A7
So it end up doing the same thing as a push or a pop, but it also show th power of the instruction set.
Woooo... Personally, that is waaaay beyond my understanding. :) I never understood Assembly.
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut text and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...idk. I'm not looking at it properly
Ennev wrote to Ennev <=-
the 68000 had a address bus of 24 bit, giving it just 16MB of
addressable ram, was kind of honorable in the mid 80's but all the
address register where 32bit internally. Future proofing it, you code would work on a 4GB address space when available without modification.
Jagossel wrote to Ennev <=-
Woooo... Personally, that is waaaay beyond my understanding. :) I never understood Assembly.
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut text and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...idk. I'm not looking at it properly
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut text and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...idk. I'm not looking at it properly
In emulation for C64 and Amiga ( on most machine of theses day) the only thi you'll need is the bios or rom portion of it.
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: Bigbangnet to Ennev on Tue Oct 24 2017 08:22 pm
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut tex and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...id I'm not looking at it properly
what editor do you have on that system.the editor when replying to msg. I discovered it when messing around. It was CTRL plus arrow keys. its the messages on dovenet
are you talking about quoting? i use ctrl q to quote
Ennev wrote to Bigbangnet <=-
I cheat, most of the time I reply by using the webservice at : http://mtlgeek.synchro.net:8080/ on my board or a use a news reader
like thunderbird using port 119.
Jagossel wrote to Ennev <=-
Doesn't the ROMs in any 8-bit computer has an operating system coded in it? Granted it's just basic hardware operations and a BASIC (or some variant of Microsoft BASIC) interpreter?
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut text and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...idk. I'm not looking at it properly
If you go in your default setting you can pick an external editor, I have FSEditor there, enable you if you have a good terminal to move the cursor around more like an editor like Nano.
sysops: Any other good editor for Synchro on linux ?
Doesn't the ROMs in any 8-bit computer has an operating system coded in it? Granted it's just basic hardware operations and a BASIC (or some variant of Microsoft BASIC) interpreter?
i use an old version of slyedit.
Doesn't the ROMs in any 8-bit computer has an operating system coded in i Granted it's just basic hardware operations and a BASIC (or some variant Microsoft BASIC) interpreter?
In a way yes, Commodore64 like TRS-80 had a basic with embedded IO functions to load a program from tape for example. A game cartridge would bypass that, powering on a system with a cartridge would make the computer boot straight the cartridge code.
Newer system like amiga,pc and mac had a bios that wasn't an os. but just a library of standard function and a bootstrap code so the machine could load os or a game straight from the drive. I'm not sure but i think the Atari ST had the full os in rom.
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: MRO to Ennev on Wed Oct 25 2017 09:13 pm
i use an old version of slyedit.
Why the old version? Are there any issues you saw with newer versions that you'd like to see fixed?
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: Ennev to Bigbangnet on Wed Oct 25 2017 07:21 am
sysops: Any other good editor for Synchro on linux ?
i use an old version of slyedit.
i use an old version of slyedit.
Why the old version? Are there any issues you saw with newer versions that you'd like to see fixed?
We had a modem for the TRS-80 as well, but never used it. Now, I'm curious as to what it would have been like to connect to a BBS on a TRS-80. We had everything to use the modem (including a terminal software on cartrige), just never used it.
I enjoy the SlyEdit v1.51, not sure if that is the latest, but it meets my need.
We had a modem for the TRS-80 as well, but never used it. Now, I'm curi as to what it would have been like to connect to a BBS on a TRS-80. We everything to use the modem (including a terminal software on cartrige) just never used it.
Just picture one letter at a time scrolling across your screen as you try to read 3 or 4 pages of a message.
Something like what you would get if your put SyncTERM's baud rate simulation down to 300? :D I never had the pleasure of using a 300 baud
We had a modem for the TRS-80 as well, but never used it. Now, I'm
curi as to what it would have been like to connect to a BBS on a
TRS-80. We everything to use the modem (including a terminal
software on cartrige) just never used it.
Probably just gave my age away a bit, there. :)
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: Jon Justvig to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 2017 12:34 am
I enjoy the SlyEdit v1.51, not sure if that is the latest, but it
meets my need.
That's the latest version. :)
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
Just picture one letter at a time scrolling across your screen as you
try to read 3 or 4 pages of a message.
Something like what you would get if your put SyncTERM's baud rate simulation down to 300? :D I never had the pleasure of using a 300 baud modem, I think we started out with 9600 when we got serious about BBSes.
Probably just gave my age away a bit, there. :)
Something like what you would get if your put SyncTERM's baud rate simulation >down to 300? :D I never had the pleasure of using a 300 baud modem, I think we
started out with 9600 when we got serious about BBSes.
Probably just gave my age away a bit, there. :)
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: MRO to Ennev on Wed Oct 25 2017 09:13 pm
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: Ennev to Bigbangnet on Wed Oct 25 2017 07:21 am
sysops: Any other good editor for Synchro on linux ?
i use an old version of slyedit.
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
I started with a 2400 baud modem, that was sometimes only reliable at 1200, at a time when some of the local boards were still advertising 2400 like it was a big deal, while others were just upgrading to 9600 HST. :)
when 10GBps comes around. What is the future insight anyway. I have wondered if internet or telecommunications of some sort will be linked to a power outlet instead of a 2wire land line or a cat/ethernet cable. All we really need is the 0s and 1s anyway.
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
yeah it's like iceedit/quikedit in appearance.
communications via the power lines has been possible for a long time. i dont think it has good error correction or bandwidth.
i think the guys in charge will only give us faster speeds when its entirely necessary.
when 10GBps comes around. What is the future insight anyway. I have
wondered if internet or telecommunications of some sort will be linked
to a power outlet instead of a 2wire land line or a cat/ethernet
cable. All we really need is the 0s and 1s anyway.
communications via the power lines has been possible for a long time. i dont think it has good error correction or bandwidth.
I think the big problem would be line noise, years ago I tried the power line wifi and the packet loss was horrible.
using thunderbird...how would I configure that ? just type in the address of mtlgeek.synchronet:8080 and such ? tahts it ?How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people cut tex and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the shortcuts but ...id I'm not looking at it properly
I cheat, most of the time I reply by using the webservice at : http://mtlgeek.synchro.net:8080/ on my board or a use a news reader like thunderbird using port 119.
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface.
I remember that so well that I can still remember the filename.
PW1118.EXE the Win32S installer. First thing I downloaded onto a
computer when I had Win 3.1 installed, then Trumpet Winsock and
probably Mosaic or Cello web browser.
I heard RLL was just an encoding scheme which worked on MFM drives, so RLL didn't actually require a different controller, just a drive reliable enough to handle RLL encoding.
Something like what you would get if your put SyncTERM's baud rate simulation down to 300? :D I never had the pleasure of using a 300 baud modem, I think we started out with 9600 when we got serious about BBSes.
Probably just gave my age away a bit, there. :)
using thunderbird...how would I configure that ? just type in the address
of mtlgeek.synchronet:8080 and such ? tahts it ?
To me Windows 95 was a DOS shell with a GUI interface.
It came at a time when system horsepower increased enough to make a task switching system work -- OS/2 could run circles around Windows on a 486, but once you started seeing Pentium MMX systems, I could run my DOS BBS well enough on Windows.
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: MRO to Jon Justvig on Sun Oct 29 2017 12:03 am
MRO,
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
yeah it's like iceedit/quikedit in appearance.
Only real difference is there is not any kind of registration fees or keys to get it to work. It comes with SBBS, which I feel, has been a great addition to the software.
communications via the power lines has been possible for a long time. i dont think it has good error correction or bandwidth.
I think the big problem would be line noise, years ago I tried the power line wifi and the packet loss was horrible.
I think the big problem would be line noise, years ago I tried the power line wifi and the packet loss was horrible.
I don't know if it was the case, but I know some countries in Europe like France and here in Canada there as been some pilot project. At the end here i think that i was hard to offer bandwidth that would have competed with what
was offered with dsl and cable modem. Power being state owned in my province it gives us low prices (.0582$/kWh) but I don't think it's a great bed for innovation, I know they do research but not in communication i guess.
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
yeah it's like iceedit/quikedit in appearance.
Programming for workbech was easy having a rich library already in the bios. So manipulating strings, windows, file system was dead easy. Even in assembler theses libs where easy to implement. But game programmer prefered to take over the entire system, i guess it was easier when you where porting games. In theses years most devellopers would publish title both on Atari ST and amiga, since they where both using a 68000 as a core cpu it might have been more easy sice the os themselves where dramatically different.
The sad part is that theses games where made on ST then ported on amiga since
a 320X200 16 colours game would display on a amiga but not a 320X200 32 colours game. Its really when develloper started to make game for amiga first that the hardware was starting of being really exploited.
I was a bit the opposite. I understood assembly, but being able to see the instructions in the wider context of what a program was supposed to do was much harder for me. As a result, I found things like microcontrollers easier to program in Assembler than general purpose machines, because the microcontrollers were generally used for a dedicated purpose and didn't need the complexities of user interaction.
Newer system like amiga,pc and mac had a bios that wasn't an os. but just a library of standard function and a bootstrap code so the machine could load an os or a game straight from the drive. I'm not sure but i think the Atari ST
had the full os in rom.
My brother had a 300 baud modem for the Color Computer 2, you would manually dial the number then set the hand set on the modem to comunicate with a BBS. When I bought my Color Computer 2 I bought an auto call/answer 1200 baud modem.
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
yeah it's like iceedit/quikedit in appearance.
You convinced me. I’ll give it a try. I’ll see if I can install it in the morning.
Ennev wrote to Denn <=-
I think the big problem would be line noise, years ago I tried the power line wifi and the packet loss was horrible.
I don't know if it was the case, but I know some countries in Europe
like France and here in Canada there as been some pilot project. At the end here i think that i was hard to offer bandwidth that would have competed with what was offered with dsl and cable modem. Power being
state owned in my province it gives us low prices (.0582$/kWh) but I
don't think it's a great bed for innovation, I know they do research
but not in communication i guess.
SlyEdit [ICE] is the best.
yeah it's like iceedit/quikedit in appearance.
You convinced me. I’ll give it a try. I’ll see if I can install it in the morning.
Sometime in the future, we will look back and think 10MBps is a fast speed when
10GBps comes around. What is the future insight anyway. I have wondered if >internet or telecommunications of some sort will be linked to a power outlet >instead of a 2wire land line or a cat/ethernet cable. All we really need is >the 0s and 1s anyway.
I think the big problem would be line noise, years ago I tried the
power line wifi and the packet loss was horrible.
I don't know if it was the case, but I know some countries in Europe like France and here in Canada there as been some pilot project. At the end here i think that i was hard to offer bandwidth that would have competed with what was offered with dsl and cable modem. Power being state owned in my province it gives us low prices (.0582$/kWh) but I don't think it's a great bed for innovation, I know they do research but not in communication i guess.
Re: Re: Intro to pc:: question on editing
By: Ennev to Bigbangnet on Wed Oct 25 2017 07:15:48
How do you properly edit text here. I mean, I've seen some people
cut tex and insert text between it. I've tried to look at the
shortcuts but ...id I'm not looking at it properly
I cheat, most of the time I reply by using the webservice at :using thunderbird...how would I configure that ? just type in the address of mtlgeek.synchronet:8080 and such ? tahts it ?
http://mtlgeek.synchro.net:8080/ on my board or a use a news reader
like thunderbird using port 119.
It took me a while to get assembly, but once I did, it was like a switch flipped. It seemed so simple, compared to other stuff I was learning (or trying to learn) at the time. Mostly just pushing bits from one memory location to another (on the C64, anyway).
Bestbuy have powerline , Homeplug and other name device using
electricity
outlet , it work great but only on same circuit , if pass thru
Electric/breaker BOX , Does not Work well
I think that implies that OS/2 was a bit more efficient though, at least for multi-tasking DOS applications. I actually had the impression that OS/2 was superior to Windows overall. I've more recently read articles talking about OS/2's GUI task queue being inefficient which could freeze the GUI, but I read that was fixed in (I believe) OS/2 Warp 4.0.
I assume at some point in the future, it will all be telepathic. :)
Yes I have friends who use this to extend theirs network at home, it's an elegant solution and can be quite fast.
As for Internet access over power lines, not a great idea. Putting high frequency signals onto open lines is called a radio transmitter, and you're going to cause huge interference to HF radio communication - not just hams, but long haul aircraft and other services. And you will suffer interference from legitimate transmitters as well.
And WinQVT and WinVN. And Eudora Light.
Powerline ethernet adapters use your home's power circuit to transmit network data. As far as I know, they don't transmit anything over radio waves..
Back when DOS could do one thing at a time, we were running OS/2 1.3 with a graphical interface, and I could call BBSes with a comm app, run Word and Excel natively, and connect to both networks - one running a terminal program, and copying files to/from the MS Lan Manager network - on a 386/25 with 8 megs of RAM.
I used OS/2 in 1993/1994 to run console apps; I managed a Netware network at the time. You could create a VM with a specific version of DOS, create a VM with DOS drivers if there wasn't an OS/2 version, and multitask DOS - I remember dialing 2 BBSes and not dropping any packets at 38400.
What ended my time with OS/2 was trying to get TCP/IP working when I already ran Netware - I ended up cheating and putting a second network card in my system at work!
There's going to be a lost generation - kids nowadays are going to grow up hunched over from looking at their phones. In 10 years or so, they'll have neural matrix implants and kids will walk upright again.
Yes I have friends who use this to extend theirs network at home,
it's an elegant solution and can be quite fast.
I've used them for some time. I can get 40 mbps on connections on the same floor and 20 mbps crossing circuits to another floor. Once every couple of weeks they need to be power cycled, but they're a cheap, easy solution for networking.
Powerline ethernet adapters use your home's power circuit to
transmit network data. As far as I know, they don't transmit
anything over radio waves..
The radio waves happen sort of incidentally / as a byproduct. These devices transmit a changing electrical signal or a particular frequency into unshielded wiring. The wiring, not originally designed to suppress RF radiation, ends up serving as a poor antenna. It's a problem with commercial efforts to provide broadband internet access over powerlines; I'm not sure how much of an issue it is with consumer level devices that use household wiring.
Derision wrote to Vk3jed <=-
It took me a while to get assembly, but once I did, it was like a
switch flipped. It seemed so simple, compared to other stuff I was learning (or trying to learn) at the time. Mostly just pushing bits
from one memory location to another (on the C64, anyway).
Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-
Powerline ethernet adapters use your home's power circuit to transmit network data. As far as I know, they don't transmit anything over
radio waves..
Ennev wrote to spacesst <=-
Yes I have friends who use this to extend theirs network at home, it's
an elegant solution and can be quite fast.
echicken wrote to Nightfox <=-
The radio waves happen sort of incidentally / as a byproduct. These devices transmit a changing electrical signal or a particular frequency into unshielded wiring. The wiring, not originally designed to suppress
RF radiation, ends up serving as a poor antenna. It's a problem with commercial efforts to provide broadband internet access over
powerlines; I'm not sure how much of an issue it is with consumer level devices that use household wiring.
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Speaking of TCP/IP, I was using OS/2 in a VM a few years ago, and I was surprised to see that OS/2 required you to reboot your system to change its IP address. I don't remember having to do that back in the day,
but then I was mainly using dialup networking in the 90s to connect to
the internet and didn't have ethernet going at home.
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
If things keep going like that, it seems we may become like the Borg
some day..
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
I started using powerline ethernet adapters a couple years ago. It
seems to also depend also on the brand & model you're using. Currently
I'm using a pair of Extollo LANSocket 1500 adapters, which were the fastest I saw on the market a couple years ago. I'm using one
downstairs and one upstairs, and I'm not sure if they're crossing
circuits or not, but after I bought them I did a speed test and saw
speeds of up to 140 mbps with them. I'm not sure I feel like wiring my house for ethernet, and at this point I've actually found wi-fi more reliable than the powerline ethernet adapters. The powerline ethernet adapters do work well much of the time, but they drop their connection sometimes.
Nightfox wrote to echicken <=-
Interesting.. I hadn't heard about broadband internet access that way, although I've heard of Comcast using their customers' wifi access
points to provide public access points for Comcast customers. And
every so often I see a Comcast access point when I'm out somewhere. I don't use Comcast anymore, but when I did, I found I could log into
those Comcast access points with my Comcast user ID & password and use
it for wi-fi internet access.
Bestbuy have powerline , Homeplug and other name device using electricity
outlet , it work great but only on same circuit , if pass thru
Electric/breaker BOX , Does not Work well
Yes I have friends who use this to extend theirs network at home, it's an elegant solution and can be quite fast.
Interesting.. I hadn't heard about broadband internet access that way, although I've heard of Comcast using their customers' wifi access points to provide public access points for Comcast customers. And every so often I see a Comcast access point when I'm out somewhere. I don't use Comcast anymore, but when I did, I found I could log into those Comcast access
I've had mixed results using wifi for internal bridging, but good reults outdoors. I also prefer to keep wifi for devices that actually need it (i.e. mobile/portable - laptops, phones, tablets, etc), and have all fixed machines wired in.
Yes I have friends who use this to extend theirs network at home, it's
an elegant solution and can be quite fast.
whats better is drilling a hole in the floor and running wire.
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Re: Re: Introduction to compu
By: Dumas Walker to JON JUSTVIG on Mon Oct 30 2017 06:02 pm
I assume at some point in the future, it will all be telepathic. :)
There's going to be a lost generation - kids nowadays are going to grow
up hunched over from looking at their phones. In 10 years or so,
they'll have neural matrix implants and kids will walk upright again.
I've had mixed results using wifi for internal bridging, but good reults outdoors. I also prefer to keep wifi for devices that actually need it (i.e. mobile/portable - laptops, phones, tablets, etc), and have all fixed machines wired in.
Normally I'd prefer to have fixed PCs wired too, but it seems sometimes wired networking (with powerline ethernet adapters, etc.) might be less reliable than wifi.
If you simply drill holes and run wire through them, I wonder if that would cause problems with moisture getting inside the drywall from humidity over time. I suppose there's the same issue with electrical outlets & coax outlets etc., but I'd think there must be a way to help prevent moisture/humidity buildup and mold inside the drywall..
I feel sorry for the Little and Big Kids who have to wear a backpack.
Interesting.. I hadn't heard about broadband internet access that way, although I've heard of Comcast using their customers' wifi access points to provide public access points for Comcast customers. And every so often I see a Comcast access point when I'm out somewhere. I don't use Comcast anymore, but when I did, I found I could log into those Comcast access points with my Comcast user ID & password and use it for wi-fi internet access.
well i dont know if you can throw in powerline ethernet adapters into the category of wired networking. just plain ethernet works great.
Re: Re: Introduction to compu
By: Ed Vance to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Oct 31 2017 21:36:00
I feel sorry for the Little and Big Kids who have to wear a backpack.
I was one of those kids in middle and high school that had the large and heavy backpacks. The problem is that the schools have teachers that all would assign homework everyday and only allow a few minutes to go from one side of the school to another on a large campus, often in crowded hallways,
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
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Re: Re: Introduction to compu
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Dumas Walker on Tue Oct 31 2017 09:22 am
There's going to be a lost generation - kids nowadays are going to grow up hunched over from looking at their phones. In 10 years or so, they'll have neural matrix implants and kids will walk upright again.
If things keep going like that, it seems we may become like the Borg
some day..
Re: Re: Introduction to computers
By: Ennev to Muhammad Al-Khwarizmi on Mon Oct 23 2017 09:12:49
Oh yes, that's the thing. The vast majority of games where taking over, they only way out was reboot. They would totally take over the entire system, the os was multi-tasking but forget it when I game was running. From this aspect it was acting much more like a game machine.
One of the things that I've had some trouble getting used to is the idea of booting software off floppies again. On the C64, it's a no-brainer. You're either using a physical disk or a .D64 as a virtual disk and running off that. But my brain has been so conditioned by Macs and Windows that I *WANT* everything to run within Workbench, and that just isn't how it is. There's plenty of stuff that doesn't even need (or want) the OS to run.
One of the things that I've had some trouble getting used to is the idea of booting software off floppies again. On the C64, it's a no-brainer. You're either using a physical disk or a .D64 as a virtual disk and running off that. But my brain has been so conditioned by Macs and Windows that I *WANT* everything to run within Workbench, and that just isn't how it is. There's plenty of stuff that doesn't even need (or want) the OS to run.
Use WHDLoad?
Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-
Powerline ethernet adapters use your home's power circuit to transmit network data. As far as I know, they don't transmit anything over
radio waves..
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Speaking of TCP/IP, I was using OS/2 in a VM a few years ago, and I was surprised to see that OS/2 required you to reboot your system to change its IP address. I don't remember having to do that back in the day,
but then I was mainly using dialup networking in the 90s to connect to
the internet and didn't have ethernet going at home.
Vk3jed wrote to echicken <=-
laptop over, and its power supply took out the powerline network, every time it was plugged in, so there are a small number of devices that can disrupt the etwork.
Vk3jed wrote to Nightfox <=-
I can't recall. I did have a LAN running IP, but my IP addressing remained static for many years.
Vk3jed wrote to Nightfox <=-
If things keep going like that, it seems we may become like the Borg
some day..
You will be assimilated. ;)
Jagossel wrote to Ed Vance <=-
I was one of those kids in middle and high school that had the large
and heavy backpacks. The problem is that the schools have teachers that all would assign homework everyday and only allow a few minutes to go
from one side of the school to another on a large campus, often in
crowded hallways, leaving no to little time to stop by a locker.
Vk3jed wrote to echicken <=-
laptop over, and its power supply took out the powerline network, every time it was plugged in, so there are a small number of devices that can disrupt the etwork.
LED christmas lights play havoc on my throughput here.
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Re: Re: Introduction to compu
By: Ed Vance to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Oct 31 2017 21:36:00
I feel sorry for the Little and Big Kids who have to wear a backpack.
I was one of those kids in middle and high school that had the large
and heavy backpacks. The problem is that the schools have teachers that all would assign homework everyday and only allow a few minutes to go
from one side of the school to another on a large campus, often in
crowded hallways, leaving no to little time to stop by a locker.
It seems like kids these days have computers instead of books, now...
Huh, didn't think I would have told one of those "I had to walk 5 miles
to school in the snow..." type of stories. Those young whipper-snapoers and their new fangled adding machines... <g>
Speaking of TCP/IP, I was using OS/2 in a VM a few years ago, and I
was surprised to see that OS/2 required you to reboot your system to
change its IP address. I don't remember having to do that back in
the day, but then I was mainly using dialup networking in the 90s to
connect to the internet and didn't have ethernet going at home.
That was about the time that I started using NT Server 3.51; it looked just like Windows 3.11, but I had the eerie feeling that it was going
to be the start of something big.
I've read that Windows NT was based on OS/2 (Microsoft was working with IBM on OS/2, and I heard Microsoft was able to take a version of the OS/2 source code when they split). I've seen screenshots of early versions of OS/2's Presentation Manager, and it looked a lot like Windows 3.x..
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